Women in military combat roles?

[AdAstra2009]

Personally I'm against women in combat for a variety of reasons. I'm not going into it because it can get political. I will put one point out though. I've read that Islamic fighters do not surrender when it is a women as oppose to a man because they consider it shameful to surrender to a women.

Originally Posted by Spartan198

Israelis have recently started opening combat roles to women.

From what I've read the Israelis stopped using women in combat units because of the negative effect it had on male soldiers morale when women were wounded/killed.

[Rockwolf66]

I can say as a fact that the British had women in undercover roles in Northern Ireland and those women had the same chance of combat as their male counterparts and as such recived the same level of training. The only real differance between the two was that the women tended not to have the leverage to fully control a G3KA4 and that they prefered the Walther PPK to the Browning High Power.

[MT2008]

It really sounds to me like a case-by-case basis is what's necessary to determine it. I know plenty of women who would probably perform better in combat than I would. I don't let that bruise my ego; I think that if they can fulfill the demands of the job, they should be allowed to do it.

But statistically, we do have to face facts: In general, women tend to be less physically and mentally capable than men. So women will inevitably be under-represented in combat roles no matter what. If the forces of political correctness start demanding that we scale down the requirements so that women can meet them, then I would be strongly opposed.

Originally Posted by Nyles

I'm serving in combat with women right now, and frankly it's a non-issue. A soldier is a soldier, man or woman. There are no occupations left in the CF that are gender segregated.

As for the old argument about women getting raped if captured, well, I've got news for you. If you are a man and get captured in Afghanistan, chances are you're going to get raped. This is not bashing Islam (which I have no patience for), or gay panic, or demonizing the enemy, it is a simple fact of life. In fact over here, because of Pashtunwali, women stand LESS chance of getting raped than men.

Yeah, I've heard the same thing. The Pashtun are so afraid of women that they actually like little boys better. It's a running joke about them.

Originally Posted by AdAstra2009

I've read that Islamic fighters do not surrender when it is a women as oppose to a man because they consider it shameful to surrender to a women.

Then how do you explain the Iraqi soldiers in the Gulf War surrendering to newscrews, many of which had female reporters?

Originally Posted by k9870

Its more that if several soldiers are captured, a terrorist will threaten to kill or torture the women to make male prisoners talk, this is actually quite effective, as men crack to protect a woman way easier than to protect other men.

Yeah, but that's something you can train them to deal with because it's based mostly on culture. It doesn't strike me as a compelling enough reason.

As I've said, I think that even if SF were open to women, there would still be almost no women (if any) who qualified. So it strikes me as a moot point.

[Spartan198]

Originally Posted by MT2008

Then how do you explain the Iraqi soldiers in the Gulf War surrendering to newscrews, many of which had female reporters?

How do you explain Saddam's Iraqi army being considered an army to begin with?

[MT2008]

Originally Posted by Spartan198

How do you explain Saddam's Iraqi army being considered an army to begin with?

Good point.

But seriously, they were mostly Muslims, I'm sure. Some of them probably had Islamist tendencies. And anyway, the jihadists are mostly cowards (aside from a select few Islamist groups who are decently tough).

[Excalibur]

During WWII, The Russians employed women in their frontline military. Israel also has women in active combat duty.

[MT2008]

Originally Posted by Excalibur

During WWII, The Russians employed women in their frontline military. Israel also has women in active combat duty.

Well, yes, but that was because (1.) Stalin was spending men's lives quite rapidly against the Germans, and (2.) they were egalitarian Commies trying to impose social engineering upon the population.

I think the most relevant factor in the debate is whether or not women are up to the task. Individual women might be, but that's probably going to be rare.

[Spartan198]

Not to mention they had the Germans literally beating down their front door, something the US hasn't experienced since the 1800s and likely never will again.

[AdAstra2009]

Originally Posted by MT2008

Then how do you explain the Iraqi soldiers in the Gulf War surrendering to newscrews, many of which had female reporters?

Poor morale/no will to fight

And by Islamists, I am referring to Taliban fighters/Insurgents

[Nyles]

Originally Posted by MT2008

Yeah, I've heard the same thing. The Pashtun are so afraid of women that they actually like little boys better. It's a running joke about them.

It's not so much that, but as a Pashtun dishonoring a woman is pretty much the worst thing you can do. It's like child rape to us (which, to them, while frowned upon, not as big a deal).

The thing about women in the military is that once you get over it, the whole thing seems kind of silly. There will never be many women in the infantry, but those that are make damned good soldiers. I don't want to sound like a holier than thou Canadian, but one thing I've noticed about working with US troops is they have a huge hang-up about it.

My friend Anna, who before transferring to our current trade was an infanteer, went on an exercise in the states where she was one of two females, both Canadians obviously. They gave them separate tents, drove them out of the field every night to shower, their officers gave big speeches about leaving them alone, etc, and alot of them couldn't wrap their heads around the idea of a female combat soldier. Well, of course female soldiers aren't going to work if you treat them like that.

No female soldier I've worked with wants special treatment, those that do are shitpumps, but they're no different from any male shitpump I've ever worked with (and there seems to be more of those). Treat them like any other soldier, that's what they'll be. In the CF, in garrison female soldiers won't share a room with males, and there are separate bathroom facilities. That's all.