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  #21  
Old 12-03-2010, 04:25 PM
BurtReynoldsMoustache BurtReynoldsMoustache is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zulu Two Six View Post
*sarcasm* WHAT ARE YOU GUYS DOING!!!!! burt is never wrong! why would you question him
Take a moment to think about if this was happening here in the United States. This isn't a bunch of police officers making arrests, this is a military operation. They are literally at war with their own citizens.
  #22  
Old 12-03-2010, 04:28 PM
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It can't happen in this US without major political backlash against the government and as you know, the US government likes to keep it's constituents happy so they can vote them into office.
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  #23  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:04 PM
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In brazil cops are killed on a regular basis and there crime situation IS A WAR. Its different than america. And burt, seriously, what do you say we do, legalize all drugs and dish out welfare checks like halloween candy?
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  #24  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:16 PM
BurtReynoldsMoustache BurtReynoldsMoustache is offline
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Originally Posted by k9870 View Post
In brazil cops are killed on a regular basis and there crime situation IS A WAR. Its different than america. And burt, seriously, what do you say we do, legalize all drugs and dish out welfare checks like halloween candy?
Drugs, yes. Welfare checks, no.
  #25  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:26 PM
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You do know those gangs dont just traffic drugs, theyve got gun running, human trafficking, chop shops and stealing valuables, right? There a threat, a bigass threat, to everyone and seeing them wiped out is good.
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  #26  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:26 PM
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Drugs? Maybe Pot, but none of the other illegal drug serve a purpose but to addict people and kill them.
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  #27  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:35 PM
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Everyone stop acting so stupid, or this topic gets it. How many times have I asked y'all?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BurtReynoldsMoustache View Post
Take a moment to think about if this was happening here in the United States. This isn't a bunch of police officers making arrests, this is a military operation. They are literally at war with their own citizens.
Except that Brazil is nothing like the United States. Our drug dealers haven't killed dozens of cops with weapons like HMGs and RPGs. In terms of their weapons and tactics, the favela gangs are far more comparable to paramilitary or insurgent forces than they are to the Crips and Bloods. So it is necessary for BOPE to act like a military force (and, in this op, work with actual military personnel) in order to fight them.

I suppose you also feel the same way about Mexico (Mexican troops have been deployed to fight the cartels on countless occasions)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BurtReynoldsMoustache View Post
Drugs, yes. Welfare checks, no.
Neither of these is going to happen anytime soon (and Brazil has no control over American drug laws, anyway), so you might as well deal with reality. As long as there is a problem, BOPE has to deal with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by k9870 View Post
There a threat, a bigass threat, to everyone and seeing them wiped out is good.
Although I disagree with Burt that it's wrong for the Marines to take part in this operation, you are wrong about this last part. They aren't going to be able to "wipe out" the drug gangs. As long as there is poverty and drugs are illegal, the gangs will always exist. By occupying the favelas, the BOPE and Marines will be able to repress the gangs, but it won't be permanent. As soon as they leave (which they'll have to do eventually, because military occupations are expensive, especially for a country like Brazil), the gangs will return.
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Last edited by MT2008; 12-03-2010 at 05:46 PM.
  #28  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k9870 View Post
You do know those gangs dont just traffic drugs, theyve got gun running, human trafficking, chop shops and stealing valuables, right? There a threat, a bigass threat, to everyone and seeing them wiped out is good.
You're missing the point that running into a shantytown guns blazing isn't really a solution to any of those problems. Legalize drugs (and guns) and you've delivered a tremendous blow to the gangs' abilities to organize and resist. Yes they'll still be up to no good with human trafficking and property theft, but the real money is in drugs. You can't finance an army with the profits from a chop shop, and it's alot easier to maintain the moral high ground (and therefore garner public support) when you're up against people who prostitute children as opposed to people who sell some powders to consenting adults.
  #29  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:52 PM
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There not strolling around guns blazing, there occupying and setting up security, and only shooting in defense. You make it seem like there hosing anybody in the street.

And legalizing RPGs and belt fed MGs will not stop gang violence.....and cars are legal, the gangs still steal them. As to human trafficking, im waiting for your response.
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  #30  
Old 12-03-2010, 05:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BurtReynoldsMoustache View Post
You're missing the point that running into a shantytown guns blazing isn't really a solution to any of those problems.
They're not going in guns blazing exactly (though obviously they are conducting armed raids). They are occupying the favelas. There is a difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BurtReynoldsMoustache View Post
Legalize drugs (and guns) and you've delivered a tremendous blow to the gangs' abilities to organize and resist. Yes they'll still be up to no good with human trafficking and property theft, but the real money is in drugs. You can't finance an army with the profits from a chop shop, and it's alot easier to maintain the moral high ground (and therefore garner public support) when you're up against people who prostitute children as opposed to people who sell some powders to consenting adults.
You seem to have trouble separating your ideals from what is practical. The Brazilians don't have any control over American drug laws.

Also, while I am not opposed to Brazil reducing its gun laws (which are pretty ridiculous), I sure hope you're not naive enough to believe that armed citizens are going to be a match for drug gangs with automatic weapons and RPGs? Not to mention that there's a thin line between civilian and drug dealer in places like this. I am not sure one could expect much "resistance" to the gangs even if guns were easier to get.
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