Stance on gun control

[S&Wshooter]

Every gun law is a stepping stone to further gun laws, with the ultimate goal of complete civilian disarmament. No matter how good intentioned such laws may be, history has shown that once they get rolling the push for further restriction doesn't stop. For everyone one of these incidents on the news (highlighted specifically to turn public opinion against gun rights) of Billy Bob shooting Cletus in a road rage incident, there are thousands of (intentionally) unreported defensive gun uses

[Jcordell]

Originally Posted by S&Wshooter

Every gun law is a stepping stone to further gun laws, with the ultimate goal of complete civilian disarmament. No matter how good intentioned such laws may be, history has shown that once they get rolling the push for further restriction doesn't stop. For everyone one of these incidents on the news (highlighted specifically to turn public opinion against gun rights) of Billy Bob shooting Cletus in a road rage incident, there are thousands of (intentionally) unreported defensive gun uses

I know I know. You make a good point as well.

[MT2008]

Originally Posted by S&Wshooter

Every gun law is a stepping stone to further gun laws, with the ultimate goal of complete civilian disarmament. No matter how good intentioned such laws may be, history has shown that once they get rolling the push for further restriction doesn't stop. For everyone one of these incidents on the news (highlighted specifically to turn public opinion against gun rights) of Billy Bob shooting Cletus in a road rage incident, there are thousands of (intentionally) unreported defensive gun uses

Understood. I prefer to make a distinction between what I support in theory (i.e., I don't think any and all gun control laws are inherently bad and/or unconstitutional) vs. what I am willing to support given our current meta (i.e., I recognize that in our hyper-polarized society, almost any gun control laws are likely to become a slippery slope to outright bans).

One point that I think needs to be considered and discussed more often by the absolutists on our side: If we say any and all gun control laws are unconstitutional, and oppose them only on that basis, it's only a matter of time before a "Repeal the 2nd Amendment" movement gains steam. There are already a growing number of folks on the left calling for such a repeal now than there were 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago. That is partially a result of the left in this country becoming more radical in general, but it's also a result of many on the right becoming more radical and "in your face" about gun ownership than before.

[Jcordell]

Originally Posted by MT2008

One point that I think needs to be considered and discussed more often by the absolutists on our side: If we say any and all gun control laws are unconstitutional, and oppose them only on that basis, it's only a matter of time before a "Repeal the 2nd Amendment" movement gains steam. There are already a growing number of folks on the left calling for such a repeal now than there were 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago. That is partially a result of the left in this country becoming more radical in general, but it's also a result of many on the right becoming more radical and "in your face" about gun ownership than before.

You are right. And with that then how long before there is a move to repeal other amendments which are just getting in the way of doing things. Maybe not the 1st but the 4th or 5th amendments are a pain in the neck aren't they. I suppose we could repeal the 3rd and nobody would care - until the military started quartering troops on your property because of housing shortages or budget issues.

No easy answers are there.

[MT2008]

Originally Posted by Jcordell

You are right. And with that then how long before there is a move to repeal other amendments which are just getting in the way of doing things. Maybe not the 1st but the 4th or 5th amendments are a pain in the neck aren't they. I suppose we could repeal the 3rd and nobody would care - until the military started quartering troops on your property because of housing shortages or budget issues.

No easy answers are there.

Strangely enough, NPR (about 5 years ago) had a piece which made essentially the same points. The Constitution isn't perfect, which is why there is a mechanism to change it, but just because you can (in theory) doesn't mean you should. And certainly, we should have learned our lesson by now with Prohibition working out the way it did.

[funkychinaman]

This refusal to compromise is going to doom this country. This country was built on compromise, right or wrong. In the past, I also had the sense that both parties were motivated by the best interests of the country and its people, rather than just trolling and getting invited to cable news.

[MT2008]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

This refusal to compromise is going to doom this country. This country was built on compromise, right or wrong. In the past, I also had the sense that both parties were motivated by the best interests of the country and its people, rather than just trolling and getting invited to cable news.

I did, too, but in retrospect, that was youthful naivety on my part. Politicians are always motivated by ego and power, and I can't imagine that was different 25 years ago. It's just that our polity back then was a lot more rational, because times were different (end of the Cold War, budget surplus, pre-9/11, pre-recession, etc.), so politicians weren't incentivized to troll POTUS at the State of the Union or pander to favored groups along tribal lines in order to get attention on the news and social media. In the 1990s, the Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Marjorie Taylor Greenes of the era were fringe figures who could never get elected to Congress; now they're supported by large pluralities in their respective parties (though not majorities – yet).

One other point I will make: The Ukraine War has made it a lot more difficult for me to be as comfortable aligning myself with the right, because I find it abhorrent that so many conservatives are openly sympathetic towards Russia in the conflict.

[Jcordell]

Originally Posted by MT2008

One other point I will make: The Ukraine War has made it a lot more difficult for me to be as comfortable aligning myself with the right, because I find it abhorrent that so many conservatives are openly sympathetic towards Russia in the conflict.

I understand. It is also interesting to note that in the Thirties as the Japanese Empire and Nazis were causing problems it was many a popular commentator (Father Coughlin) and politician (Huey Long) in the U.S. who publicly stated that they sided or at least sympathized with Germany and were against the U.S. getting involved. The more things change I suppose.