For want of a shotgun

[Evil Tim]

You're assuming psycho / sociopaths have a good grasp of indoor combat tactics. Some of these guys don't even realise they can shoot through wooden doors. Often when you read accounts of spree killers encountering locked doors their solution was to bang on the door and demand the occupants open it, because they're that far gone that they think they have a right to kill those people.

Plus, commercially available shotguns tend to be a bit on the big side.

[funkychinaman]

Originally Posted by Evil Tim

You're assuming psycho / sociopaths have a good grasp of indoor combat tactics. Some of these guys don't even realise they can shoot through wooden doors. Often when you read accounts of spree killers encountering locked doors their solution was to bang on the door and demand the occupants open it, because they're that far gone that they think they have a right to kill those people.

Plus, commercially available shotguns tend to be a bit on the big side.

In the US, at least, you can start with a full sized field gun and legally modify it to a shorter gun. For example, you can start with a Remington 870 field gun, buy a shorter barrel, and then buy a pistol grip or folding stock.

And if you're want to do something illegal, sky's the limit.

[Excalibur]

Yeah, there's nothing stopping a criminal from legally purchasing a very short barrel to make an SBS to use in a crime...and I always point this out...defeats the purpose of the NFA that punishes you for making one NOT for criminal use.

[funkychinaman]

Originally Posted by Excalibur

Yeah, there's nothing stopping a criminal from legally purchasing a very short barrel to make an SBS to use in a crime...and I always point this out...defeats the purpose of the NFA that punishes you for making one NOT for criminal use.

Or just walking into a Walmart buying a Remington 870 Express for $300, and cutting down the stock and barrel at home.

[funkychinaman]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

Or just walking into a Walmart buying a Remington 870 Express for $300, and cutting down the stock and barrel at home.

BTW, hypothetically, would I be able to legally cut down a 26" barrel to a still legal length?

[Maxman]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

BTW, hypothetically, would I be able to legally cut down a 26" barrel to a still legal length?

As long as it is at least 18" with the bolt closed, it does not become a short barrelled shotgun.

Here in Canada, a rifle or shotgun barrel can likewise be shortened to 18", but any shorter and it becomes a prohibited device (it's something of a grey area to shorten a barrel that is already under 18").

[Excalibur]

I've been eyeing this really old Browning auto 5 that's been at my local gun store. It's barrel is the shortest it legally can and just handles really well. For 350, it's a steal

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by Evil Tim

You're assuming psycho / sociopaths have a good grasp of indoor combat tactics. Some of these guys don't even realise they can shoot through wooden doors. Often when you read accounts of spree killers encountering locked doors their solution was to bang on the door and demand the occupants open it, because they're that far gone that they think they have a right to kill those people.

About "shooting through doors"--I'm sure that the Oscar Pistorius case has alerted many to that fact if they didn't know it already. And yes, these killers often seem so blinded by rage they don't know what to do when stopped by a locked/barricaded door. The Isla Vista shooter had the brains to write a 100-page-plus manifesto, but had no idea what to do other than resort to shooting people on the street when the building he most wanted to enter was locked (as he should have known it would be).

Still, the door-breaching ability of shotguns isn't that hard to find out about, and relatively simple to perform with widely-available tools. Haven't there also been reports of gang members going undercover and joining the US military to get military training to use in crime as well? That's another source.

Originally Posted by Excalibur

Yeah, there's nothing stopping a criminal from legally purchasing a very short barrel to make an SBS to use in a crime...and I always point this out...defeats the purpose of the NFA that punishes you for making one NOT for criminal use.

I haven't heard of many crime reports where shooters fancy themselves the next Clyde Barrow and use cut-down shotguns. Do you have some links?

[funkychinaman]

Don't you need special ammo to breach doors?

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

Don't you need special ammo to breach doors?

You need special ammo to do so with the largest margin of safety, but even birdshot will work, as will buckshot and slugs.