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  #11  
Old 01-19-2017, 06:30 PM
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Evil Tim Evil Tim is offline
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Originally Posted by commando552 View Post
I think the grenade launching muzzle is just one of the features that will make a semi-auto rifle with a removable mag banned isn't it? As the SKS has a non removable magazine isn't the number of features it has irrelevant, or is the legislation there different now than the classic AWB?
Nope, Yugo SKS is specifically banned as a destructive device, the ones with detachable magazines get dinged as "assault weapons." I mean nevermind that this ruling would presumably ban every weapon with a NATO 22mm flash hider.
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  #12  
Old 01-19-2017, 10:23 PM
commando552 commando552 is offline
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Nope, Yugo SKS is specifically banned as a destructive device, the ones with detachable magazines get dinged as "assault weapons." I mean nevermind that this ruling would presumably ban every weapon with a NATO 22mm flash hider.
Hadn't seen that specific ban before, but that is bizarre. The Cali assault weapons ban reads "A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following: 1) a pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon; 2) a thumbhole stock; 3) a folding or telescoping stock; 4) a grenade or flare launcher; 5) a flash suppressor; or 6) a forward pistol grip", so if a rifle with a grenade launcher is illegal, why list it as a feature that would turn a detachable magazine rifle into an AW? And as you say, there are a large number of other weapons that take the NATO standard 22mm grenades that are not affected. I assume the reason that they picked on this one is because it is actually called a grenade launcher, as opposed to other weapons where part of the barrel just so happens to be 22mm wide.

Looking into the wording of that ban it kind of reads like they banned it because they misunderstood what it was. It reads "The factory brochure claims that the grenade launcher launches a 22 mm (approximately .80 caliber) grenade." To me this reads as if they banned it based on the "the barrel or barrels of which have a bore of more than one-half inch in diameter" part of the DD definition. This is not the case with this gun though, as the 22mm is the external rather than internal diameter.

Also, and this is a more general US gun law question, can a state deem something to be a destructive device? Isn't this defined by the NFA and overseen by the BATF, not the California DOJ? Granted, they could still ban the firearm by name but that isn't what they did in this case.

Either way, looking into it you can still legally have a Yugo SKS in CA, you just need to either remove the grenade launcher itself, or make it incapable of a grenade sliding over it by doing something like welding on a sleeve, or even just laying down a line of weld.
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  #13  
Old 01-21-2017, 09:31 AM
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Evil Tim Evil Tim is offline
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I'd imagine a state would define it since the US is a federal rather than a unitary state, so any power not explicitly reserved by the central government belongs to the state governments. State can say how it's going to enforce a Federal law and as long as they're not playing too loose with the description that's ok, IIRC.

Last edited by Evil Tim; 01-21-2017 at 09:35 AM.
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  #14  
Old 01-29-2017, 08:51 PM
StanTheMan StanTheMan is offline
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My advice would be don't go to CA. As that isn't really an option it seems, SKS or something of the like works - IF you can manage to jump through all the hoops to where it's ok. I like the idea of a lever-gun though for home defense I've always been a fan of the shotgun. Plenty of power and less worry about over-penetration. That and in the case of pump guns they almost always dodge most of the even looniest loony liberal firearms laws without a bunch of dancing like you have to do with 'evil' rifles.

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Originally Posted by commando552 View Post
Looking into the wording of that ban it kind of reads like they banned it because they misunderstood what it was. It reads "The factory brochure claims that the grenade launcher launches a 22 mm (approximately .80 caliber) grenade." To me this reads as if they banned it based on the "the barrel or barrels of which have a bore of more than one-half inch in diameter" part of the DD definition. This is not the case with this gun though, as the 22mm is the external rather than internal diameter.
Well, you'd be right. Sense is the one critical thing those who write and signed off on those laws seem to seriously lack. After all, they were the same ones who decided to ban guns 'by name' rather than by type or features first, almost solely because they truly thought only certain brands of guns were causing violent crime - And when they did, gunmakers simply renamed their models and thus were in full compliance even though many of 'banned' firearms actually changed little if at all. Anyone using the slightest bit of rational and intelligent reasoning rather than charged emotion and sheer arrogance would have seen that's what would have happened, but whatever.

Quote:
Originally Posted by commando552 View Post
Also, and this is a more general US gun law question, can a state deem something to be a destructive device? Isn't this defined by the NFA and overseen by the BATF, not the California DOJ? Granted, they could still ban the firearm by name but that isn't what they did in this case.
Evil Tim has it in a nutshell - Individual states can make their own exclusions in addition to the existing federal regs. Thus yes while there are 'federal' classified destructive devices a state could also have 'destructive device' laws of their own, if they so choose.
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