imfdb.org  

Go Back   imfdb.org > The Forum > Just Guns

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 03-13-2009, 05:45 PM
MT2008's Avatar
MT2008 MT2008 is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,507
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yournamehere View Post
Eh, no. I saw a photo of a Neo-Nazi, not a muslim, with an Uzi.

There we go.
That's pretty funny...although if you want to get nitpicky, she's holding the Uzi CARBINE, which is the semi-auto civvie version, not an actual Uzi subgun.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-16-2009, 01:04 AM
jdun jdun is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 101
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MT2008 View Post
The thing I worry about is the fact that the Dawa Party (al-Maliki's party) used to be Iranian proxies during the Iran-Iraq War. Not sure I feel comfortable handing billions in American-made weaponry to people like that. But, I guess it was the best we could do.

Does Iran really use the CQ as standard-issue nowadays? I usually see them pictured with AK variants, and I know they manufacture the Type 56 under license. They used to use G3s (also made under license, dating back to the days of the Shah), but I think those have been mostly phased out nowadays.
Iranian PSD use UZI that are made in Iran. Elements of Iranian SF use AR15 that are made in Iran.

Hezbollah and Hamas has their own small arms weapon factory. The factory produce AR and AK.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-16-2009, 06:30 PM
MT2008's Avatar
MT2008 MT2008 is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,507
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdun View Post
Iranian PSD use UZI that are made in Iran. Elements of Iranian SF use AR15 that are made in Iran.

Hezbollah and Hamas has their own small arms weapon factory. The factory produce AR and AK.
The Iranian Uzis and AR-15s are actually just licensed copies from Norinco, aren't they? The Chinese have manufactured both the CQ (AR-15) and Uzi clones for a while now, and just about everything the Iranians make is licensed from them.

Hezbollah and Hamas make ARs and AKs? I find that hard to believe because I've seen lots of videos of their Qassam rockets, which are no matter advanced than anything I could build in my back yard. Their Yasin RPGs, likewise, are extremely crude copies of the RPG-2. I always figured that Iran and Syria provided them with their AKs, while the M16s were stolen from the Israelis and South Lebanese Army (for Hamas and Hezbollah, respectively)? Not to mention that the U.S. left behind a huge number of M16A1s when we pulled out of Lebanon in the early-80s.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-16-2009, 07:37 PM
jdun jdun is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 101
Default

Firearms are simple machine. You got 10 years old kids in Africa building AKs. Hell I saw a video on youtube video a while back where a guy made an AK in a cave.

Firearms were invented in a time where there was no electricity, no cars, no computers, no phones, no airplanes, no pumping, no public school, etc. If they were able to do it with little education, I'm sure most of you are capable of it.

It isn't hard to mass produce firearms.

I don't see why the Iranian needs to buy licensed copies from the Chinese. It's not like they own the patents. Those expire long ago and the Chinese didn't invent or patent them. All they need from the Chinese are milling machines which doesn't cost much or they could make it themselves.

Hezbollah and Hamas makes AK, AR, and whatever firearms they like in their home, garage, or any place that can give them privacy. The Iranian also supplies them with ARs.

Hezbollah and Hamas mainly use ARs.

This is an Iranian made AR that is use by Hezbollah:


This is an Hezbollah made AR. Notice it is flat top. It is not A1 or A2 and look brand new.


Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-16-2009, 07:46 PM
jdun jdun is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 101
Default

(was limited to four pictures per post)

Here are the Israeli PSD personnel. Notice they have color strip on their AR? They are there to determined friends or foe because Hezbollah and Hamas gunmen mostly use AR.



Here is a video where a bunch of terrorists are using AR. Notice the AR. Those were not made in the 70's.
http://rpginn.com/index.php?option=c...=526&Itemid=39

We gave a lot of AR to the Lebanon government. We did not leave it around like it was suggested in the movie Lord of War. The Lord of War to me was 100% pure Hollywood BS.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-17-2009, 12:55 AM
MT2008's Avatar
MT2008 MT2008 is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,507
Default

Point taken on "Lord of War". I have heard (not from a movie) that the U.S. left behind many M16s in Vietnam, so I figured it would make sense if the same happened in Lebanon. But that's what I get for trusting Hollywood.

Hezbollah actually runs gun factories? I do realize that many of the militants manufacture weapons, but I always figured the stuff they made was pretty simple. The rockets and RPGs I see are crude stuff, so I never would have imagined they could build something like an M4 (like that one Hezbollah gunman is holding) and build all the plastic parts and all that.

AKs would be simple to make, though - I have seen images of tribesmen in Pakistan (mostly NWFP and FATA) who can make exact copies of the AKM and Type 56. They're pretty good copies, too, although I think they lack chrome-lined barrels.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-17-2009, 04:47 AM
jdun jdun is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 101
Default

I do apologize if I came in too strong with my comments. It was not my intention.

I believe there was only 1,800 or so Marines that was stationed in Lebanon between 1982-1984. There wasn't much to be left behind by the Marines. The arms assistant program did provide lots of weapons to the Lebanese government. You still see government troops using A1 or A2 rifles and US armored vehicles.

Hezbollah makes their weapons in their own home, business shops, schools, etc. Not a full blown weapon factory per said.

AK receiver are made out of 1mm sheet metal. You can buy AK flats for around $13.00-$50.00 each depending on where it came from without the needs for FFL transfer.

http://www.copesdistributing.net/ind...sort=2a&page=1

For AR, the lower can be built on any material that is strong enough to hold the the upper and trigger pack. I've seen pictures where the lower receiver was built with wood. They can get away with it because the lower receiver is stress free.

Here one that was built from a cutting board.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3chSzLxPuzU

Anyway great site that back their information with proofs (picture still from movie). Keep up the good work!
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-17-2009, 08:07 PM
MT2008's Avatar
MT2008 MT2008 is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,507
Default

"Too strong"? What?

I have heard the South Lebanese Army receives surplus American and Israeli M16 rifles (mostly A1s and A2s), and I figured this was the primary source of such weapons for Hezbollah gunmen.

As far as AKs go, I agree those are quite easy to manufacture compared to AR-15s/M16s. I've even encouraged my Dad to try and built a receiver himself (he wouldn't bother with the flat) and complete the rest with an AK parts kit. Though I'm sure he could build the entire thing from scratch if need-be.

Glad you like our site!
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-18-2009, 03:44 AM
jdun jdun is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 101
Default

The whole international small arms smuggler is overblown. In the past I have seen Youtube videos where third world kids are making AKs and selling them for $50 in weapons market. Who wants to buy an $800 AK from an international small arms smuggler when you can go get one for $50 in the open arms market. Support the local economy you know.

Most third world killings are done with blade and blunt weapons. If you look at all the genocide in Africa, you will find by far the weapon of choice are blade and blunt weapons.

The latest news is that Mexico are getting AR for the USA. These Mexican's drug gangs are using full auto AR. So I doubt it was made from the USA.

In the US full auto AR cost well over 25k each if you can get someone to sell it to you. Those full auto AR are made in Mexico by Mexicans. If you're a drug lord, which would be cheaper? Buy a 10k CNC milling machine and produce all the full auto AR that you like. Or try find someone in the USA willing to sell you a full auto AR for at least 25k and then smuggle it back to Mexico?
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-19-2009, 01:26 AM
MT2008's Avatar
MT2008 MT2008 is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 2,507
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdun View Post
The latest news is that Mexico are getting AR for the USA. These Mexican's drug gangs are using full auto AR. So I doubt it was made from the USA.

In the US full auto AR cost well over 25k each if you can get someone to sell it to you. Those full auto AR are made in Mexico by Mexicans. If you're a drug lord, which would be cheaper? Buy a 10k CNC milling machine and produce all the full auto AR that you like. Or try find someone in the USA willing to sell you a full auto AR for at least 25k and then smuggle it back to Mexico?
You could always buy a semi AR and convert it. Also, I've seen pictures of confiscated arms in Mexico. I see plenty of ARs with 16" barrels, which is the U.S. civvie-required length.

Most of the sources I've seen claim that a majority of the guns in Mexico (used by both cartels and civilians looking for protection) are coming from the States, although it's hard to get an exact percentage.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:08 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.