imfdb.org  

Go Back   imfdb.org > The Forum > Just Guns

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-25-2012, 08:37 PM
zackmann08 zackmann08 is offline
IMFDB Chief of Operations
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: CA
Posts: 275
Default Use of Pistols in Combat

So I have a question for any and all members of our armed forces out there. Ive been watching a lot of these "raw" videos from Afghanistan (http://www.youtube.com/user/FUNKER530), really worth checking out by the way, and I had a question. How often, if ever, do you use a sidearm in combat? In all the footage I've ever seen in combat, be it news reels or this raw, helmet cam stuff, they are always using primary weapons (which obviously makes sense). I'm just wondering how often do you ever use your pistol? Is it solely a last ditch "I'm out of ammo for my M4" type thing? Or are there certain situations that call for a pistol instead of a primary weapon?

Thanks for the info.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-25-2012, 09:51 PM
The Wierd It's Avatar
The Wierd It The Wierd It is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Somewhere in England.
Posts: 325
Default

I always thought it was for running dry or stoppages.
__________________
You seem nervous... Is it the accent? Do you want to know how I got it?

There's only one explanation for everything that's happened to me so far: This universe is trolling me.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-25-2012, 11:56 PM
Excalibur's Avatar
Excalibur Excalibur is offline
IMFDB Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 3,815
Send a message via AIM to Excalibur Send a message via MSN to Excalibur Send a message via Yahoo to Excalibur
Default

Well for a lot of GIs, the "M4 thingy" is all you have. Only selective people in the military are given sidearms and it depends on their jobs. The vast majority of the armed forces used M16s and only selective members of the squad gets M4s depending on the mission.

It's not like games or tv and movies where every military guy gets a rifle and a handgun. There's actually not enough handguns in the military to go around
__________________

"There's a fine line between not listening and not caring...I like to think I walk that line everyday of my life."

Blessed be the LORD, my rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle
Psalm 144:1

“It is always wrong to use force, unless it is more wrong not to.”
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-26-2012, 12:05 AM
funkychinaman's Avatar
funkychinaman funkychinaman is offline
IMFDB & Forum Admin
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Bucks County, PA
Posts: 2,531
Default

The Marines changed who got what just a few years ago:

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news...arbine_070625/
__________________
"Me fail English? That's unpossible!"
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-26-2012, 12:40 AM
Spartan198's Avatar
Spartan198 Spartan198 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: The failed state of California
Posts: 2,167
Default

Most of the current and former service members I've talked to about this subject tell me they'd rather carry "a few extra mags" for their M16 or M4. Outside SOF, the general consensus seems to be that pistols are borderline useless in combat.

But, as I said, that's just from the ones I've talked to, which is a tiny minority of the whole armed forces, so who knows.
__________________
"The gun has played a critical role in history. An invention which has been praised and denounced... served hero and villain alike... and carries with it moral responsibility. To understand the gun is to better understand history."

“What is morality in any given time or place? It is what the majority then and there happen to like, and immorality is what they dislike.” - Alfred North Whitehead
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-26-2012, 02:01 AM
Excalibur's Avatar
Excalibur Excalibur is offline
IMFDB Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 3,815
Send a message via AIM to Excalibur Send a message via MSN to Excalibur Send a message via Yahoo to Excalibur
Default

Really it's not that pistols are useless in combat, but the situations GIs find themselves, pistols are inappropriate and dead weight. It's just one extra thing to worry about to them.
__________________

"There's a fine line between not listening and not caring...I like to think I walk that line everyday of my life."

Blessed be the LORD, my rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle
Psalm 144:1

“It is always wrong to use force, unless it is more wrong not to.”
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-06-2012, 10:00 PM
SPEMack618 SPEMack618 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Georgia
Posts: 742
Default

This one might take a bit so, go take a leak and grab a cup of coffee.

I carried an M-9 Beretta, I was issued on as a PFC because I carried an M-4A1 the -203 slung underneath and our TO&E called for grenadiers to carry a sidearm sense they couldn't carry a bayonet. Side note: In lieu of the bayonet, I carried my cousin's Ka-Bar that he wore on his survival vest in OEF. He gave it to me before I deployed as a sort of tailsman.

When we deployed, I had been bumped up to squad leader, but was still carrying the -203 due to a few holes in the platoon. Further note: With the exception of my platoon sergeant, PDM and SDMs, the other platoon grenadier, the SAW gunners, and the -240 team, everybody in my Platoon carried an M-4A1, but we were a Cav unit so we were still equipped as if we would be fighting from the Brads.

I used my Beretta exactly once. We were in rather close confines and I flt it would be quicker to use it then fool with getting my M-4 back in the fight just then. Fired 9 rounds from it and reholstered it. That was it. It wasn't even all that mission critical, just more a matter of convience.
__________________
I like to think, that before that Navy SEAL double tapped bin Laden in the head, he kicked him, so that we could truly say we put a boot in his ass.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-07-2012, 01:01 AM
Excalibur's Avatar
Excalibur Excalibur is offline
IMFDB Admin
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 3,815
Send a message via AIM to Excalibur Send a message via MSN to Excalibur Send a message via Yahoo to Excalibur
Default

Well recently Colt just won the contract to make new M45s for the Recon Marines, so they obviously value the pistol in combat.
__________________

"There's a fine line between not listening and not caring...I like to think I walk that line everyday of my life."

Blessed be the LORD, my rock, Who trains my hands for war, And my fingers for battle
Psalm 144:1

“It is always wrong to use force, unless it is more wrong not to.”
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 11-07-2012, 02:22 AM
Nyles Nyles is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 917
Default

Sorry to disappoint guys, but most pistols are actually issued to support troops so they don't have to needlessly carry a rifle at all times. You don't really see many in the infantry.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 11-07-2012, 11:19 AM
commando552 commando552 is offline
IMFDB Admin
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: England
Posts: 515
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nyles View Post
Sorry to disappoint guys, but most pistols are actually issued to support troops so they don't have to needlessly carry a rifle at all times. You don't really see many in the infantry.
In my experience it is the other way round. It may have been the case in the past that support troops would be issued pistols in lieu of a larger weapon, but in recent years there has been a shift to issuing them with carbines or PDWs. One reason for this is that it requires a much higher level of training to effectively use a pistol rather than a carbine or other shoulder fired weapon. Also with the increasing prevalence of body armour a pistol will not necessarily be effective.

In the British Forces pistols are only used by front-line troops who are expected to come into very close contact with the enemy, officers, specialists like machine gunners and snipers who's long is unsuitable for close personal defence, or people who are working in a confined space where they cannot carry a carbine. For this last point that pretty much narrows it down to just fast air pilots as armoured vehicle crews and helicopter pilots carry either full size L85A2s or L22A2s (they will also possibly carry a pistol as well as their carbine will be in a bracket and they may not have time to grab it before they evacuate the vehicle, but the go to weapon is the carbine).

I have personally fired a pistol in combat, but probably only two or three times. When driving I would unholster my pistol and put it on the dash in front of me when going through a particularly dodgy area so was quicker to get to than my rifle and could still drive one handed. However, if I was getting out I would go straight for my rifle. Bear in mind I wasn't actually meant to have a pistol. Someone had just managed to get their hands on some L9A1s which we smuggled out there when we deployed, and we ended up passing them on when we came home.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:57 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.