Concealed Carry General

[Excalibur]

You'd need to get different pants for an IWB holster. Even with a slim gun, adding the holster will out extra push into the pants and might not work or be comfortable, so you'd need to get a pants size larger and a good belt as well.

If you have some kind of injury, even pocket carry might be a problem depending on speed because if you've practiced, even reaching into a pocket for your gun will send your body into that flight or fight mode and you can tense up and if you have some kind of old hurt, it will hurt. So it's best to work with your injury because if you need to fight, it will add to your hurt.

Until your back gets better, I'd say avoid making decisions based on your current situation unless your back hurting is going to be a life time of hurt that can't be fixed. In that case, I'd still recommend training with the injury in mind.

Again, pick a gun that you can be comfortable carrying, be it a compact/subcompact or pocket gun. Also make sure you can SHOOT the gun and be able to aim well. A lot of people pick little bitty pocket guns that have poor sights or so small, it can feel like the damn thing is going to fly off your hand. I've shot a lot of little .380s like the LCP, and the S&W Bodyguard .380 and they can feel tiny but shoot like a cannon.

Personally, I don't like .40 but I don't want to state "that debate" here.

I highly recommend for a "fighting gun" to be either a subcompact to a mid size compact like a Glock 19 instead of a pocket gun that's really meant as a backup gun. I've seen people carry full size guns and still hide them well. Some argue on whether or not you "need" all that ammo or a big gun but it's your preference.

Again, my personal preference is that for a first time CCW shouldn't use revolvers because I believe the discipline and training behind a revolver is different compared to an auto and also easier reloads for newer shooters than with a revolver.

But most importantly is to get training. I'm saving up money and time to attend some of the classes I've been watching that does more realistic CCW training than just standing still hitting paper.

[S&Wshooter]

Originally Posted by Excalibur

Until your back gets better, I'd say avoid making decisions based on your current situation unless your back hurting is going to be a life time of hurt that can't be fixed. In that case, I'd still recommend training with the injury in mind.

I am quite literally missing some parts in my lower back, now. Good to know IWB won't press on me too much, though; took me 4 months to be able to wear a belt because of that.


I'm almost set on what I'd want to carry, still playing around with a few options. It will probably be a 9mm

[Yournamehere]

Originally Posted by S&Wshooter

I am quite literally missing some parts in my lower back, now. Good to know IWB won't press on me too much, though; took me 4 months to be able to wear a belt because of that.


I'm almost set on what I'd want to carry, still playing around with a few options. It will probably be a 9mm

If you're wearing a proper IWB setup in the proper way, it's gonna press on you to the point where it becomes uncomfortable, especially if you carry a bigger gun. I find that when I IWB my P228 that it either presses into me or sags my pants, and since I don't want my gun sagging or flopping about I cinch my belt down to keep it in place, forcing it to press into me. It's not nearly as comfortable as OWB carry but it's not unbearably uncomfortable either, but if you have a serious back problem then it doesn't sound like it's for you.

Consider OWB carry and wearing a baggy shirt or overshirt to aid concealment. I find that the gun is not much harder to conceal but it is a lot more comfortable than IWB for me. The biggest thing to look out for is the bottom of the holster peeking out of the bottom of your shirt, but if you wear something long/baggy enough or an overshirt or jacket then concealment is just fine. As far as the draw is concerned, it's not much harder to draw from concealment with a baggy/extra garment if you pay attention to your garment grab when you draw. This is slowly becoming my preference for larger gun carry.

Whether you go IWB or OWB (again, I recommend OWB if you can find a way to hide it), carrying a gun on your waist also pretty much forces you to wear an undershirt in order to protect your skin from the metal gun which will fluctuate in temperature from hot to cold depending on where you go throughout the day, and in order to protect the gun from your sweat. I'm pretty much forced to wear a tank top under my shirt when I carry my P228 and it just makes south Florida that much hotter for me.

Pocket carry is tricky but super doable if you have the right setup. I carry my Model 60 no matter what the weather is like outside and I don't every worry about printing or getting made or anything like that because my setup is so idiot proof. If you get a good pocket holster and a proper gun, then the gun profile will vanish in your pocket (granted you wear spacious pants with large, deep pockets and you don't have huge legs that will press against the gun when you sit or crouch or anything like that). My DeSantis Nemesis is a good little pocket holster and only about 20-25 bucks online, so I recommend that to people if they consider pocket carry. However, I have been looking into Remora as they offer custom options like mouth reinforcement for reholstering ease, and most importantly, sweat guards on the holster. Half the time I go to put my Model 60 away at the end of the day, there's a wet spot on the metal between where the holster ends and the grip begins and I have to wipe it off. It's a good thing the gun is stainless or it would have rusted something fierce by now. Pocket carry will assuredly slow your draw, but when it comes down to concealability and convenience it is the best method hands down. Also, always dedicate a pocket to carrying your gun and NOTHING ELSE. You should never put stuff in your pocket on top of your gun for any reason, especially since your draw stroke is already a bit slower. Go for something that has a good finish too, since the gun will probably be exposed to sweat or moisture being in a pocket so close to your leg.

As for pocket guns, depending on your pocket size you can get away with some pretty big stuff. I've entertained the notion of pocket carrying autos like the Kahr K9, the Beretta 84F, the S&W 3919 and the 6906, among others, and I have faith that they are all easily carried with the proper holster and pants. I don't recommend any micro autos in .380 or 9mm because even if they are highly concealable, they are just crappy guns. You have no real estate to grip them so reloading and clearing malfunctions sucks, and they are more likely to need reloading since their mags are so small, and more likely to fail since their tolerances are so tight. Worst of all, when you do fire them, they kick like a mule because the caliber they fire is too hot for their design, and you have no grip real estate. When I had my Walther PPK (which isn't even a really light subcompact at 21 ounces without ammo), it shot very accurately but it kicked worse than all of my full sized 9mms, and this was with warm .380ACP loads. I can only imagine how bad a P238 or Bodyguard is. So, while they may be easy to carry, they are bad at everything else, which I find unacceptable in a carry gun. Yeah you may find one that's reliable and that you can reload well (probably not), but you could probably find a bigger gun that fits in your pocket that can do those things too, and shoot better. Find that gun.

If you must go as small as you can, I recommend all steel .38 Special revolvers like J frames. There are a lot of downsides to them, but I still think they are overall the best micro guns for pocket carry or general concealment.
They can be grabbed by the cylinder and stopped dead in their tracks, but autos can be pushed out of battery leaving the same problem. Granted, a slide grab might give you one shot if the slide stays in battery, where a revolver is done if the cylinder is stopped, so take that as you will. You will also not be reloading them very quickly, even with speedloaders (don't even bother with speed strips, they are a slow and unreliable means of reloading and require too much technique to master next to speedloaders which will always be faster, more reliable and easier to master). A revolver hammer is a snag magnet as well, though you can go with hammerless options.
Despite these problems, a revolver will not have a magazine or recoil related malfunction like an autoloading gun, and it cannot be pushed out of battery in a really close engagement. Most importantly, as long as the cylinder/hammer remain free to move, you will have 5 rounds at your disposal regardless of where the gun is, under your shirt, in your pocket, whatever. This can make the difference in tight situations. Since I don't view micro guns as "fighting guns" but more like "at least I have a gun" guns, meaning they will work in a fight where reloads probably aren't necessary, and capacity between micro autos and snub revolvers is negligible, I find them to be the best bet for a super small gun. Avoid airweight and .357 Magnum snubs like the plague, though, because the former will kick like a mule and the latter doesn't offer much more ballistic performance than a .38 Special in a proper loading, and will kick like a mule.

[funkychinaman]

Speed strips are a lot easier to conceal than speedloaders, IMHO. I can fit two of them in an old cell phone holster on my belt.

I'd like to think you wouldn't need more than five or six rounds in a self-defense situation though. If you need more, maybe you should reconsider going to wherever you're going.

[commando552]

My only real experience with concealed carry was with a vertical shoulder holster. For what I was using it for it worked perfectly well, mainly because I had to conceal a full size Browning Hi Power, and not being able to take my jacket (or an outer shirt depending on the weather) off wasn't really an issue as that concealed a whole bunch of other stuff like magazines, vest, radio, etc. I will say though that I did spend pretty much a solid day adjusting the thing to get it to the point where it was just right for me which is obviously not so much of an issue with a waist holster. I have tried IWB holsters, and to me they always seemed a hell of a lot less comfortable and harder to ignore than that shoulder holster, but this might just be that I would have to get used to them.

With your back injury, can you comfortably draw quickly from a normal strong side IWB position? Assuming you are carrying at around the 4 o'clock you will most likely have to twist your back slightly to get your hand to the grip, and particularly in a self defence situation I can imagine overdoing it to get the hand back to their gun and screwing your back up. At one point I had a herniated disc (luckily it was minor and pretty much fully healed without intervention in about 5 or 6 months), and while that was still giving me problems this was the case for me.

A shoulder holster (along with cross draw or appendix holsters) would have the advantage that you are just reaching across the front of your body without having to twist. A disadvantage though, I don't think a lot of ranges or classes will let you use a shoulder holster due to the fact that the muzzle will most likely (definitely in the case of a horizontal holster) be pointing behind you at some point during the draw. This means that it could be harder to practice live firing with it.

Another advantage of a shoulder holster if you are going for something like a Galco Miami Classic, is that it has built in magazine holders. This has a few advantage, first being that it balances up the holster making it more comfortable. Secondly, it is one less thing you have to find room for on your belt or in your pockets, along with the fact that it is a lot quicker to put on. A shoulder holster also has the advantage that there is no messing about with having to have the write trousers on or belt and you don't need to thread anything or do anything up (with the huge caveat though that you have to wear something over the top though).

[S&Wshooter]

I've been in a few situations in which I've needed to carry, what's worked best is IWB, front of hip left side, barrel pointing away from body. People say don't carry appendix, but I'm not pointing it into my body like a lot of people do so I don't see a problem. I mean, I can swing that fairly well under a hoodie or something, or if I had a smaller gun under a decent shirt

[Excalibur]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

I'd like to think you wouldn't need more than five or six rounds in a self-defense situation though. If you need more, maybe you should reconsider going to wherever you're going.

I and the few classes I have taken do not subscribe to mentality of "if you need more than X amount of bullets in a gun fight, you need to rethink your situation" or whatever variation of that line. I carry one spare mag with me and that's 19 extra rounds for if something's wrong with the mag I got in my gun other than it being empty, like a tac reload or malfunction. The mag I have in the gun is 15 and plus 1 in the chamber. Do I really need to use that many rounds in an actual fight, I don't know, I've never been in a gun fight. Every fight is different for you. It's best to be prepared. Now do I have a minigun in the trunk of my car and grenades down my pants? no, that's just silly and beyond the point. It's always about what you are prepared to do. I've seen guys that carry 2 spare mags or a backup gun as well and they don't feel over dressed but that's their preference.

I can't do appendix carry because I got a gut. It just doesn't work for me.

[S&Wshooter]

Originally Posted by Excalibur

I can't do appendix carry because I got a gut. It just doesn't work for me.

Hell, no matter what I do I'll have a gut (runs in the family; my Navy Corpsman cousin has one even though he's the biggest gym rat I've ever met), but it never bothered me Mexican carrying my 459. I reckon it'd even be less of a problem with a smaller gun.


I think minor uncomfortable things don't really bother me as much as they do others, just because I am already pretty much physically incapable of being completely comfortable

[AdAstra2009]

Originally Posted by funkychinaman

I'd like to think you wouldn't need more than five or six rounds in a self-defense situation though. If you need more, maybe you should reconsider going to wherever you're going.

Same logic why I only carry my handgun with it's 7+1 rounds of 9mm and no extra magazines. I'm not looking for trouble and the gun is only for me to get away alive.

[Yournamehere]

Call this rhetoric but this is what has always made sense to me. If it's ever worth carrying a gun, then it's worth carrying the biggest gun you can with the most rounds you can carry as long as it doesn't compromise concealment. The whole reason one carries is because they want to be prepared for any sort of attack they may come across, and attacks come in all shapes and sizes with any number of assailants or weapons, and it's not something you can predict. If you believe in preparedness as an extension of concealed carry, you shouldn't opt for under-preparedness in favor of preparedness. This is the same logic people use to justify not carrying a gun at all. At the end of the day, if you value your life and subscribe to the philosophical aspects of carry, you should not find arbitrary reasons to minimize your shooting capabilities. You will not be pulling out gunfight statistics when you are accosted by one man with a knife or 5 thugs with guns, you will be pulling out your gun. Make sure your gun is the right one. Or that your conveyance of your statistical analysis is damn convincing.

There are plenty of reasons that people of certain body types, medical conditions or job/dress requirements can cite to justify them carrying really small guns, but full grown men of sound mind and body don't have an excuse for not carrying a fighting sized gun and two reloads in my opinion.

Granted, this comes from a guy who carries a J Frame .38 90 percent of the time hehe. I always have it, but then again I always feel undergunned. I can't wait until I get something that combines capacity with rust resistance so I don't have to worry about my P228 rotting or my Model 60 running out of ammo.