Region-appropriate firearms: South America

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by ManiacallyChallenged

Hey wow, did you do that whole page?
I never heard of the game before, but I think I'll check it out because I'm such a big STALKER fan.

Awesome page too, good quality all around!

Yes, I made the majority of the Boiling Point page. The only things I didn't contribute there are the "developer's promo image" pictures.

Thanks for the reminder of the FAMAE SAF Submachine Gun. I had forgotten I'd seen it previously in Hitman: Blood Money, in a level that's located in Chile. In that game the FAMAE SAF is pretty similar to the MP5.

So if South American forces are using the M16A2, is the IMBEL MD-3 (a 5.56x45mm rechambering of the FN FAL) then redundant? I can at least understand the niche that the Steyr AUG fills (a bullpup rifle with a scope can be more useful in certain circumstances than a full-size assault-rifle), but the M16A2 seems to be in the same niche as the IMBEL MD-3. Is the FN FAL still the premiere battle rifle of South American forces?

How realistic is the appearance of the Uzi series of SMGs/Machine Pistols? I remember seeing one in the film City of God, but that's just one movie about one Brazilian favela (slum).

And is Taurus International still the most popular semiautomatic handgun manufacturer in South America? How about revolvers?

[Nyles]

Well, Brazil is the only country that uses the MD-2 series. You can't really treat South America is a monolithic block, every army is different and uses different equipment. Most countries are replacing or have replaced the FAL, I think Argentina is probably the most notable holdout.

[Markit]

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

So if South American forces are using the M16A2, is the IMBEL MD-3 (a 5.56x45mm rechambering of the FN FAL) then redundant? I can at least understand the niche that the Steyr AUG fills (a bullpup rifle with a scope can be more useful in certain circumstances than a full-size assault-rifle), but the M16A2 seems to be in the same niche as the IMBEL MD-3. Is the FN FAL still the premiere battle rifle of South American forces?

As Nyles said, you can't really describe South America as a monolithic entity. The MD-3 may be in the same niche as the M16, but it was also primarily oriented towards Brazilian security forces rather than export. The M16 on the other hand is more common in countries which have received a degree of American support, whether it was during the Cold War or as part of military assistance for counter-narcotics operations.

Likewise, although the FN FAL is still present in the arsenals of many South American countries, it is not uncommon for most countries to have several different service rifles depending on the type of unit. For instance, while Peru still officially uses the FN FAL as its standard service rifle, its special forces use M4 Carbines and Galils, while airborne infantry use the AKM.

[Markost]

Well, here´s a short summary of the available weapons in South America:

- Colombia: M4, M16 and variants), Galil, G3, M60, RPGs.

-Venezuela: Fn Fal, G3, Uzi, Dragunov, Ak-103, Fn Mag, RPGs, Igla.

- Brazil: Imbel Fal Variants, Fn Mag, Taurus handguns, Rossi shotguns and rifles, Madsen LMG (yep, they´re still in service) and several assault weapons in hands of drug dealers (M1, Mini 14, Ar variants).

- Peru: FM Fal, F2000, some Scar 16 & 17,...

-Ecuador:FN FAL, SIG 540, M16A2-A4, M4, Steyr AUG, HK-33, Uzi, PSG-1, FN MAG, Milkor MGL, AGS-17, Browning M1919,...

- Chile: H&k G36, Sig 540, Galil, MG3, M40, Famae Saf, ...

- Uruguay: Ak-101, FM Fal, Steyr AUG, Fn Mag, Famae Saf...

- Argentina: FM Fal, Fn Mag, MG3, Steyr Aug, M4, 9mm Ar, Uzi, FMK3, Fara 83, M16, Famae Saf, Sig 556, Fap, Mp5, Minimi...

-Paraguay: chinese CQ rifles and carbines (M16 copy), Fn Mag, Ar variants.

-Bolivia: FM Fal, Akm, Type 56, Fn Mag.

I agree that the Colt Anaconda is an odd choice (as are alot of the more obscure Russian weapons like the PSS).

Trust me, big caliber revolvers are very popular here.

I'm also at a loss for other "local" firearms companies in South America--IMBEL and Taurus International are the only South American firearms manufacturers I know about, but surely they can't be the only ones. They're just the most well-known, right? Kind of how Colt is just the most famous American small-arms manufacturer, but is by no means the only one of note. I'd appreciate it if anyone could clear this up.

Indumil (Colombia)
Rexio (Argentina)
FM (Argentina)
Bersa (Argentina)
Rossi (Brazil)
Famae (Chile)
Dine (Ecuador)
Sima Cefar (Peru)
Cavim (Venezuela)

[Mazryonh]

Thanks for the info so far, but how about handguns? Which company's products are the most common over there?

Given that there's also a bandit faction in the game composed of small-time thugs, goons, and crooks, are there any police reports talking about the most-confiscated or witnessed guns being used in criminal incidents in South America?

Part of the reason I'm asking this is to compile a list in case I ever find it possible to make a "more realistic weapons" mod for Boiling Point: Road to Hell.

[Markost]

Originally Posted by Mazryonh

Thanks for the info so far, but how about handguns? Which company's products are the most common over there?

Taurus don´t has a great reputation here (we don´t like brazilian products), so the most common handguns are Glocks, Bersas, Cz´s, and FM´s copies (at least in my country).

Given that there's also a bandit faction in the game composed of small-time thugs, goons, and crooks, are there any police reports talking about the most-confiscated or witnessed guns being used in criminal incidents in South America?

Well, during the last years, brazilian drug dealers have been using stolen Fals, Pam Smgs, grenades and Madsens Lmg from Argentina. You´ll found Taurus revolvers and some military rifles (even old bolt-action Mausers). The most common calibers in hands of the criminals in my country (according to police reports) are the .22lr and 9x19 mm. The confiscated guns are Hi-Powers stolen from the police, old .22 revolvers and some old .22 Bersas.

Part of the reason I'm asking this is to compile a list in case I ever find it possible to make a "more realistic weapons" mod for Boiling Point: Road to Hell.

Well, you could fix the location. That fictional country looks like the bastard son of Colombia and Mexico.

[Nyles]

Taurus doesn't actually make bad guns (well, anymore), but they're pretty unpopular in Canada because there is zero customer support or parts available. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out the most common centerfire pistol in anyone's hands in South America would be the Hi Power.

[Markost]

Originally Posted by Nyles

Taurus doesn't actually make bad guns (well, anymore), but they're pretty unpopular in Canada because there is zero customer support or parts available. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out the most common centerfire pistol in anyone's hands in South America would be the Hi Power.

Trust me, Taurus don´t sell the same guns in North America and South America. There´s a big quality difference between markets.

[BurtReynoldsMoustache]

Originally Posted by Nyles

Taurus doesn't actually make bad guns (well, anymore), but they're pretty unpopular in Canada because there is zero customer support or parts available. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find out the most common centerfire pistol in anyone's hands in South America would be the Hi Power.

Isn't the Hi Power the most popular handgun in the world?

[Mazryonh]

Originally Posted by Markost

Taurus don´t has a great reputation here (we don´t like brazilian products), so the most common handguns are Glocks, Bersas, Cz´s, and FM´s copies (at least in my country).

Well, during the last years, brazilian drug dealers have been using stolen Fals, Pam Smgs, grenades and Madsens Lmg from Argentina. You´ll found Taurus revolvers and some military rifles (even old bolt-action Mausers). The most common calibers in hands of the criminals in my country (according to police reports) are the .22lr and 9x19 mm. The confiscated guns are Hi-Powers stolen from the police, old .22 revolvers and some old .22 Bersas.

Well, you could fix the location. That fictional country looks like the bastard son of Colombia and Mexico.

Thanks for the info. When you wrote "FM's copies" did you mean "FN Herstal clones" instead?

"Realia" in Boiling Point: Road to Hell I think has more resemblance to Colombia than Mexico. First among these tip-offs is the of the "FAPC" guerilla faction ingame, which is obviously a pastiche of Colombia's own FARC (last I heard Mexico does not have a similar leftist insurgency). Next is the complete lack of desert terrain ingame (then again that depends on where you are in Mexico). You should look at the screenshots I posted and see for yourself.

And why would Taurus International proverbially "shoot itself in the foot" by shoving off inferior quality products outside of South America? Surely they want to gain a reputation for selling and supporting reliable and high-quality firearms in more than just their home continent?

Finally, do ordinary South American citizens in "high-conflict countries" carry personal firearms around more frequently than Americans do? Last I heard ransom kidnapping is big business there, what with the drug cartels or leftist guerillas looking to make more money on the side. It's understandable to want to have a gun to defend yourself if you're caught in the crossfire of random driveby shootings or become the mark of a drug addict who's going through withdrawal and is looking to finance the next fix by mugging you.