General gun talk
 

General gun questions and comments.

Anyone else follow shot?

http://www.youtube.com/user/Sturmgew...10/dGWcARn7ER0

a shotgun for mall ninjas, more mall ninja-y than the ksg even!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fS3vHnEQXBg&feature=fvst

the tavor is here :)

And cerberus managed to anger me again, they fixed the acr by shaving 2 pounds off, but only on mil/le models. Guessus civvies aren't important enough?

Ten bucks says it'll be in Modern Warfare 4.

My bet is a $3000 MSRP

If any of the bullpup is cheaper than 2000, I'd get them

I could only ever get ambi ones like Microtech's AUG clone or the FS2000, since "bullpup" generally means "fuck you, lefty"

I should sue companies that manufacture non-ambi bullpups for discrimination just to see what would happen

To be fair, most all guns are designed for right handed users so are inherently saying as you put it, "fuck you, lefty".

The shotgun I'm not impressed with really. It's a new design for one, meaning it's untested. Just as well it requires a rotation of the magazine after every 4 shots which may prove to be a real pain in a firefight. Coupled with the limitations of shotguns in most situations as well as the weight of such a high volume of shotgun ammo in the weapon, it's hardly ideal, and not really worth the amount of money you're going to pay for it next to the street price you can pay for an old and dependable single tube pump action or semiautomatic shotguns.

Even the competition, the KSG, which has some issues of its own, is still more viable as it holds a close amount of rounds, 14, and only requires one flick of a switch to change tubes, and two tubes of 7 as opposed to 4 tubes of 4 is much easier to keep track of if you need to change from one type of round to the other (buck versus less lethal for example). Given all of this, stressing the highly niche usage of a shotgun as well, I don't quite see the merit in this design over the KSG or, again, simple, cheap pump action or semiautomatic shotguns. I'll gather more interest when I see (reliable) magazine and drum fed shotguns.

As for the Tavor, $3000 or even $2000 is steep given the rifle has a polymer body and will be produced at least mostly in the US. The Tavor may well be a competitive rifle in the market though as decent bullpups are relatively limited and typically expensive, and with the advantages of the bullpup layout, and the rifles other inherent features, it may well find a great following if the price is right. I'm certainly intrigued by it myself.

Also, this thread would be better as a SHOT Show thread than the "general" thread which was seemingly made as an excuse to post SHOT stuff anyway, don't you think?

Its a general talk thread to keep going for a while. Shots over but other stuff will come up, just shots the biggest industry event and just happened. Gun questions, comments, etc can go here instead of new threads each time.

Also, SW, i think the tavor is ambi. And dont go into any ar-15 centric forums, they all seem to cry about how reversible ejection rifles like the ar160 are useless and left handed people can use right handed guns just fine so they don't "need it." They never think a left handed person might waqnt to be on similar ground. My friend got a stag ar since it was the only one offered left handed. Someone on one forum said that left handed people have an advantage with right handed guns as they can see the ejection port to know of malfunctions. If this is a advantage then those stags would be in the hands of right handed shooters. too bad the only people with a left hand revovler are charter arms and they suck.

People also say that ARs shooting from the left hand can get brass in your face. That's what the brass deflector is for and it's never bothered me. People who bitched about the brass hitting you is just crying

Yeah, but shooting normal guns left-handed won't eject brass straight into your face or smack you in the jaw with the bolt handle

Also to be a proficient shooter, you HAVE to learn how to shoot with both hands. So the debate of all guns are for right handed is moot point when right handed people are supposed to be training themselves to shoot with the other hand in the first place.

No. Just...no.

I don't know of any bullpup with a bolt handle that reciprocates and/or is placed close enough to hit someone in the face. And shooting a normal AR may in fact pelt you in the face with brass anyway. They really like to eject almost straight back, even with a brass deflector.

"Being a proficient shooter" has a million different meanings to a million different people, and I'm doubtful that many are even close to proficient with their non-dominant hand as they are with their dominant hand. I agree that the ability to shoot with your non-dominant hand is a very valuable trait to have, especially if you're talking defensive situations, but it's necessity is weighed down by individual perceptions of proficiency, and of course the cost of ammo and time needed to train your non-dominant hand.

SA80 series.

Not really. I have put more rounds through my father's Colt AR than I have almost any other rifle, and I cannot recall ever getting any brass to the face from it

On a related note, my P22 is notorious for spitting out brass into hair, down the backs of shirts, and into the gap between the firer's face and eye-protection

Anybody have an SKS? I almost bought one the other day, but it turned out to be Chinese

I have a 1954 Russian that I got several years ago for a reasonable price. I dont think there is anything wrong with the Norincos but I wanted a Russian one.

Bear in mind most of us are civilians and so most military grade equipment is a moot point for us.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/60823

http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:RugerMuzzelite.jpg

Century arms is not military grade at all, they suck.
'
And whats with kel tec? they show stuff at every shot show then it becomes impossible to find. They have no manufacturing capability. Also, its sad but ive heard the ar160 wont be here for a couple more years, but that thing is cool.

I haven't had too many problems with AR type weapons,. (I shoot lefty)

Had some problems with my Ruger P-95 throwing brass under my glasses.


And I'm wierd in that I like shooting a right handed bolt gun left handed.

However, my duck gun is a left handed Benelli.

About brass hitting you, I was at the range with a buddy once testing his then new .380 Bodyguard and standing behind him at the right spot, I was hit twice with brass into my glasses smack. It was the perfect spot to get hit

At an indoor range a few years ago, I got hit in the lense of my glasses by the brass from a USP that was being fired about 15 feet away from me

You asked for an example. You never said it had to be a *good* example. :p

What the hell is century arms?

basically a importing company...they will get guns from other countries then bring them to the USA, make the changes in the firearms that would make them legal here, and then sell them.

They give homeless guys a 12 pack and a dremel, point at the magwell of single stack sporting aks, say "make it bigger" and thats how a wasr is born.

Century has legendarily bad customer service and their warranty says 1 year after leaving them, not after purchase, so unless its instantly sold you dont have it long, it also says using warranty service voids the warranty. Their ak74s are known for keyholing also, they have told customers that the bullets should be tumbling end over end for maximum impact......

@ S&WShooter, I don't personally consider the AK conversions legitimate bullpups, though I can see how that bolt would be terrifyingly close to your eyeball when firing. As for the Ruger Muzzlelite, I doubt you will ever see one, let alone shoot one in your lifetime, so again, mootpoint.

Century does have terrible customer service and hit or miss build quality and as much as I am intrigued by some of their products, I don't think I'll ever buy one.

I've been hit in the forehead by my own gun's brass more times than I can count, mostly by my 1911 in fact. Keeps you paying attention, that's for sure. : )

As much as I've wanted to like Kel-Tec, I have to say I did not like shooting their PF-9. The one I handled didn't shoot to point of aim at 10 or even 5 yards, and yes, I took my time and was shooting just as well as I normally do with a Beretta, it was assuredly the sights on the gun. The recoil was a bit much, but it would have been better had the grip of the gun not been so uncomfortable, the checkering coupled with the length and slimness made holding it uncomfortable, and my hand's aren't even that big. The slide checking isn't aggressive enough for racking either, especially with the strong spring needed for such a small pistol, and if your hands don't stay dry as a bone. Worst of all, new out of the box with only say 60 rounds through it, the gun failed to extract 3 times (and those aren't quick to clear), so of all things, it wasn't even reliable. Their warranty will honor and fix that fault, and they say the gun has a break in period, but it's still disheartening to have that many of that particular type of failure. Ultimately, the one thing I take away from my experience with the gun is that I know which pocket gun I want between a PF-9 and an old S&W Model 60, it's not hard to tell.

I do not ever plan on firing a bullpup, I was giving an example (with "getting hit in the jaw with a bolt handle" not being the only example) to why someone who is left handed would have difficulty/wouldn't be able to fire a right-handed bullpup rifle

I saw a muzzelite at cabelas. And SW try a fs2000 its completely ambi.

Oh wow, I guess the stock sets aren't that hard to come by. I thought it was one of those weird bastardized 1980s guns whose run came and went. Even so it'd take some sort of tacky madman to buy one...

I ordered my TIS m24 sling, ill give you guys a report when i get it to the range. I think slings as a shooting aid are overlooked a lot but very helpful.

My father often shoots with a sling as his only support at ranges exceeding 300 yards with his CMP rack grade Garand.

One of the two people I know who have a Distinguished Rifle Badges, both of them swear up and down that shooting with a sling is the best way go.

I want nothing more than a M1A, not even a national match, and a M-1906 leather sling and a chance to go to Camp Perry just once.

I got into the habit during my small bore days, and now I can't shoot without one. Ironically, off-hand was the only position where we couldn't use the sling, but it's the one now where I need it the most.

I would recommend a single point sling or an adapter that allows for transition from on shoulder to another

They're referring to using a sling as a brace for stabilization and as far as I know, you can't do that with a single point sling.

Yeah...I used a single point sling for about a day until I quit using it. The whole tactical transition thin is so much horse shit. I went to my pistol once, and promptly dropped my rifle on the deck.

When I shot competitively, it was single point. Now I just use a regular sling.

You dropped it on purpose or accidentally?

A lot of experts reccomend 2 point slings, just about all hate 3 points, some still like singles. I love 2 points, i have gi surplus on my guns but cant wait for my m24 quick cuff. Prone i dont need one but standing the difference is night and day.

It was one of those accidentally on purpose things.

I realized I needed my M-9, I knew I had my carbine in my hands, neck thing I knew, I had cleared leather, well ballastic nylon, and employed my pistol and my M-4A1 was on the deck.