Combined force in Río de Janeiro
 

Brazilian marines and BOPEs during the control of the Complexo do Alemão:

http://p1.trrsf.com.br/image/get?o=c...8859-atm14.jpg
http://www.forte.jor.br/wp-content/u...G1-580x366.jpg
http://www.forte.jor.br/wp-content/u...rs-580x366.jpg
http://www.forte.jor.br/wp-content/u...RA-580x370.jpg

http://www.forte.jor.br/wp-content/u...r3-580x435.jpg

.50?????:
http://www.forte.jor.br/wp-content/u...r4-580x435.jpg


http://i1.r7.com/data/files/2C92/94A...-%20grande.jpg
http://i1.r7.com/data/files/2C92/94A...-%20grande.jpg

Almost 100 years... and still in service:
http://l.yimg.com/a/i/br/not/yreporter_1.jpg

http://l.yimg.com/a/i/br/not/yreporter_10.jpg

http://l.yimg.com/a/i/br/not/yreporter_13.jpg

http://l.yimg.com/a/i/br/not/yreporter_15.jpg

They really like those Para FAL's.

I'd like to get a DSA Para Congo, but $2k it will be a while.

So how are the cameras going to avoid showing all these guys when the olympics come around...and with all this going on right now, how are they going to get the worlds wealthy to come and watch the olympics

Well, this is a search & destroy operation, the goal is cleaning most of the favelas for 2014.

Oh no the Olympics are coming! Quick, murder all the poors!

do you always have to be negative?

Corrected by removing bullshit and replacing it with what is really happening

Apparently he does or he'll die of serve hemorrhaging. :D

I heard about this. One of the things I think is going to be interesting to watch is how they balance between law enforcement and military counterinsurgency tactics, and what lessons they're applying not only from past experience, but also from Mexico's struggle against the cartels. It's really, REALLY tricky to fight gangs who use guerrilla tactics, and the LE/military tactical balance is delicate. BOPE has more experience in this type of combat than almost any other armed unit in the world (including the U.S.), but if they're working with Marines, then maybe they're throwing the book out on this op.

Because launching a blitzkrieg against your most disadvantaged citizens is a good thing?

This is just a bullshit bandaid solution to the larger problem while simultaneously being a disgusting dick waving display of power to make the rest of the world think Brazil is actually a habitable place. They did the same thing right before Live Earth and the Panamerican Games.

"Oh shit guys, the world is paying attention to us for something other than the rainforest and carnivale! Quick, blow up some lean-to's so it looks like we actually give a crap or something! IDK this whole running a country thing is pretty tough throw some more bullets at it!" (spoken in Portuguese of course)

Btw, this operation was a sucess, the Alemao is safe now after 20 years. The next objective is the Rocinha.

http://i2.esmas.com/2010/11/26/15891...ro-300x350.jpg

http://bucket.lanacion.com.ar/anexos...298729h415.jpg

http://l.yimg.com/a/i/br/not/yreporter_11.jpg

Looks like you don´t know anything about Brazil. Acording to you, drug dealers and gangs are "disadvantaged citizens". Nice...

I know. Burt thinks this operation's objective is "kill all the poor people" for some reason

I'd rather listen to the opinion of a person who's from South America than some jerk-off in L.A.

Is one of those guys in the top picture using one of those FALs chambered in 5.56? I want one of those

*sarcasm* WHAT ARE YOU GUYS DOING!!!!! burt is never wrong! why would you question him

If they weren't poor and living in shacks they wouldn't be selling drugs in the first place. Maybe things are different down there (I don't think they are) but generally people with money don't resort to crime. People with a secure position in society don't form street gangs.

And no this doesn't make it "safe" again. They've just created a vacuum that will shortly be filled by the next gang, and they're going to go into it even more violently then the last one. Unless they just bulldozed the entire favela and built proper housing over it. And even if they did that, they'd have a shitload of displaced impoverished people. Wonder what they would do to survive then? Oh right, commit more crimes.

I wouldn't stand for this crap in my own country, I'm not going to stand for it in somebody else's.

IMBEL MD97

http://world.guns.ru/assault/braz/imbel-md-97-e.html

Take a moment to think about if this was happening here in the United States. This isn't a bunch of police officers making arrests, this is a military operation. They are literally at war with their own citizens.

It can't happen in this US without major political backlash against the government and as you know, the US government likes to keep it's constituents happy so they can vote them into office.

In brazil cops are killed on a regular basis and there crime situation IS A WAR. Its different than america. And burt, seriously, what do you say we do, legalize all drugs and dish out welfare checks like halloween candy?

Drugs, yes. Welfare checks, no.

You do know those gangs dont just traffic drugs, theyve got gun running, human trafficking, chop shops and stealing valuables, right? There a threat, a bigass threat, to everyone and seeing them wiped out is good.

Drugs? Maybe Pot, but none of the other illegal drug serve a purpose but to addict people and kill them.

Everyone stop acting so stupid, or this topic gets it. How many times have I asked y'all?

Except that Brazil is nothing like the United States. Our drug dealers haven't killed dozens of cops with weapons like HMGs and RPGs. In terms of their weapons and tactics, the favela gangs are far more comparable to paramilitary or insurgent forces than they are to the Crips and Bloods. So it is necessary for BOPE to act like a military force (and, in this op, work with actual military personnel) in order to fight them.

I suppose you also feel the same way about Mexico (Mexican troops have been deployed to fight the cartels on countless occasions)?

Neither of these is going to happen anytime soon (and Brazil has no control over American drug laws, anyway), so you might as well deal with reality. As long as there is a problem, BOPE has to deal with it.

Although I disagree with Burt that it's wrong for the Marines to take part in this operation, you are wrong about this last part. They aren't going to be able to "wipe out" the drug gangs. As long as there is poverty and drugs are illegal, the gangs will always exist. By occupying the favelas, the BOPE and Marines will be able to repress the gangs, but it won't be permanent. As soon as they leave (which they'll have to do eventually, because military occupations are expensive, especially for a country like Brazil), the gangs will return.

You're missing the point that running into a shantytown guns blazing isn't really a solution to any of those problems. Legalize drugs (and guns) and you've delivered a tremendous blow to the gangs' abilities to organize and resist. Yes they'll still be up to no good with human trafficking and property theft, but the real money is in drugs. You can't finance an army with the profits from a chop shop, and it's alot easier to maintain the moral high ground (and therefore garner public support) when you're up against people who prostitute children as opposed to people who sell some powders to consenting adults.

There not strolling around guns blazing, there occupying and setting up security, and only shooting in defense. You make it seem like there hosing anybody in the street.

And legalizing RPGs and belt fed MGs will not stop gang violence.....and cars are legal, the gangs still steal them. As to human trafficking, im waiting for your response.

They're not going in guns blazing exactly (though obviously they are conducting armed raids). They are occupying the favelas. There is a difference.

You seem to have trouble separating your ideals from what is practical. The Brazilians don't have any control over American drug laws.

Also, while I am not opposed to Brazil reducing its gun laws (which are pretty ridiculous), I sure hope you're not naive enough to believe that armed citizens are going to be a match for drug gangs with automatic weapons and RPGs? Not to mention that there's a thin line between civilian and drug dealer in places like this. I am not sure one could expect much "resistance" to the gangs even if guns were easier to get.

There are lots of drugs (mostly psychedelics) that are neither addictive nor particularly lethal. For example MDMA (ecstasy) killed 63 Americans in the year 2000. That same year saw 85,000 Americans killed by alcohol and 435,000 Americans killed by tobacco.

I thought in Brazil it is legal to get guns, just getting permits and licenses.

And as I said before, legalizing drugs won't solve the crime problem. Why do you think in the US, people are saying that is a stupid idea. Sure taxing it would raise a lot of money and would surely make it hard for the organized crime to lose their hold on it, but saying you can go into a store and buy cocaine and meth because it's legal now is a very bad idea.

Have you seen what Coke can do you you on the first try? Meth? LSD? X? I've seen people die from THAT SHIT! I knew people! I have friends in law enforcement and their lives destroyed by drug corruption! Don't tell me it is not addictive nor NOT particularly lethal! I don't care if it'll send you off to your "happy place" and then bring you back. Why don't you take a shot of heroin or some coke up your nose and tell ME how you fucking feel!

I don't want any drugs no addictive or otherwise to be legal. It's already illegal to smoke in bars and a lot of restaurants and college campus. They can't can't get rid of something that is already so wide spread and legal for decades.

Stealing a car isn't a crime of possession. It's not illegal to have a car, just to have somebody else's car without their permission. Whereas drugs are illegal no matter how you obtained them. So you're argument that "cars are legal and people still steal them" doesn't really make sense.

Anyway, if you take away the massive profits from drugs, you're left with a whole host of other crimes. Though none of them are able to maintain the level of presence and influence that criminal organizations currently have. Nobody ever threatened national security with an auto theft ring, there just isn't enough money in it.

And human trafficking? Take all the money spent on the drug war and spend it on fighting that instead. You're still not going to need an entire battalion of mechanized infantry to do it.

You´re wrong, we´re not talking about Central America Maras, we´re talking about organized crime. Just like the russian mafia or mexican drug cartels.

Dude, in the favelas you´ll find the criminals and gangster, but many people are honest and hardworking (in fact, there are more workers than criminals). The Alemao was an example of that: a gang controlling an entire zone. Once you defeat the gangs, the police and later the goverment controls the area. Just think about your neighborhood after 20 years with no government presence or police.

Oh, and about the bulldozing, there´s a plan being developed since Lula´s government to urbanize the favelas. But seriously, can you build schools, houses and streets while everything is being controlled by gangs? I don´t think so.

You realize that you need mechanized infantry when your enemy can shoot down helicopters... ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsjywM4BBpE )

So gangs are like cockroaches (figuratively). No matter how many times you flush them down the toilet, they always climb back up the bowl.

Because they've been sold on the propaganda and people in general are afraid of changing the status quo. Most people (LE personnel excluded) who campaign and crusade against drugs are very ignorant of the realities of drug using behavior, preferring to view it as a singular monolith of depravity out to snatch their children.

If people want to wreck their lives, I'd rather the profits go to publicly held corporations or legitimately run private companies instead of criminal organizations that will use the money to corrupt cops, judges, and legislators, kill people, blow up cars, and enable violently sociopathic behavior amongst their associates.

Yes, people die from alot of things. It's part of living in a free society. We are all personally responsible for ourselves. People wreck their lives in many different ways; gambling, prostitutes, bad investments, not buying proper insurance. You can die the first time you go skydiving. You can die walking down the street. Life is dangerous.

Sounds like they fucked up then. It happens. And when you say "drug corruption" do you mean they got involved with criminals and it didn't work out for them? If that's the case then I have no sympathy, corrupt cops are scum and deserve whatever they get coming to them, even more so than regular criminals.

Not all drugs are the same.

Made my nose feel a bit tingly, felt a little lifted for a few minutes, then everyone around me became very annoying and I had a panic attack. Can't say I enjoyed it, but to each his own. That was 4 years ago, I haven't touched it since. Why am I not breaking into peoples houses or performing sexual favors? Oh right, I have the ability to make informed decisions about my own life and my own actions and I value my health and sanity over fleeting moments of chemical euphoria. If other people don't, that is not my problem.

If you really believe that, then you've got a lot of molecules to outlaw, including almost every drug that is already a controlled substance, because unless it's on Schedule I, it's still legal under certain circumstances. Do you want to ban Vicodin and Oxycontin? What about Fentanyl? Fentanyl is far more dangerous than Heroin, being lethal in microgram amounts, but for patients in advanced stages of cancer it's manna from Heaven. Benzodiazepines like Xanax, Valium, and Ativan are very addictive, but absolutely necessary for people with severe anxiety and insomnia.

Do you want to ban dextromethorphan? (Robitussin) Do you want to ban dimenhydrinate? (Dramamine) What about nutmeg, should we ban nutmeg? Dust Off? Nitrous oxide? Gasoline?

How can you actually believe this statement and the previous statement? That's quite a blatant case of cognitive dissonance. MDMA is not allowed even though it is neither addictive nor very lethal (a majority of deaths are caused by overexertion or toxic impurities, not an overdose of the MDMA molecule) but it's perfectly acceptable for Joe Citizen to drink himself into a coma because, why the hell not, everybody's doing it?

The argument that you can't ban tobacco and alcohol because "They can't can't get rid of something that is already so wide spread and legal for decades." doesn't hold up in against history. Drugs being illegal is a very recent phenomenon. The use of opium, coca, cannabis, ephedra, psylocibin, and DMT go back just as far as alcohol, millenia into prehistory. And still today the use of drugs is far more widespread and popular than anyone really wants to admit. It was never not widespread. Of all the factors that lead to decreased drug use in populations, legislation and enforcement is the least relevant.

You think those organizations were born of bored rich dudes? They all started with a few impoverished individuals deciding they didn't want to follow the rules anymore and that they would get rich or die trying. The Russian mafia is an evolution of medieval bandit guilds. I don't know the exact origins of the Mexican cartels, but I'm pretty sure it wasn't a weekend project for some listless industrialists.

The gangs only have that capability because they make so much money from drugs.

That sounds like a good idea, but only if they allow the displaced population to remain. You can't kick people out, pave over everything, and then build mansions. They'll just start up a new slum somewhere else.

Human trafficking and auto theft doesn't yield enough money for that sort of thing. That was the point I was trying to make.

Gun running gets huge profits and has the hardware necessary for shooting down a helicopter or taking out a patrol all over.

Who the hell is talking about kicking people?

What exactly is the plan? How can you urbanize the favelas if you don't tear them down first? All the buildings look pretty rickety to me.