Owning a pistol without a conceal carry license
 

I'm looking to purchase a firearm legally. I own a shotgun, no restrictions or permits required, but I'd like a handgun to keep in my home and take to the range/private residences that will allow me to shoot there.

I live in a college town, so the local police department are a little uncooperative with basically everything. I have read to contact your local police department for a conceal carry, but I suspect that they won't be very helpful, and I also suspect that such a permit will cost more than the firearms I can afford.

Without such a license, how can you keep and own a handgun? Between taking it from the store and your home, your home and the range, etc, how is this manageable? I suspect keeping a firearm on the seat, even if that's the legal way to do it, is a terrible idea. The police in the area are VERY well known for random traffic stops without reason, and for searches without warrants (they've been known to tell you "you can let us or you can wait til we get in contact with the magistrate and get a warrant, and if you make us do that, we WILL find something"), so carrying it in plain sight or hidden without a permit both seem like bad ideas.

So how can I manage this? I live in West Virginia.

I suggest before you think about buying a pistol become aware of all the handgun laws in your state. For instance here if Texas a civilian who can legally own a handgun can carry that handgun in there own vehicle cocked and locked any where as long as I (a law enforcement officer) can not see it.

I get conflicting information. I get stopped fairly often (not for speeding, just because the officers around here have nothing to do), and they always ask if I have firearms or knives in my vehicle. If I had a license, or it was legal to carry them and they were in my name, I don't know why this would be an issue. I do short films fairly often, so I've got props, as well, and I always get heckled for my prop weapons (none of which fire, most are plastic). Is this just scare tactics, or?..

If you carry a handgun in your car, don't do what people say is the "right" thing to do and leave it sitting in the passenger seat (Cops are very quickly threatened by this). Put it in the glove compartment, or under your seat. If you are pulled over by a cop, calmly and politely tell the officer you have a legal firearm concealed in your vehicle. NEVER, EVER keep it loaded in the car.

And you can get a pistol permit without getting a carry permit. This just means you can't carry it on your waiste as a sidearm. Transporting it in the car is a moot point.

Open carry, keep it unloaded in "luggage" etc.

What's the rules on carrying a gun while traveling on a plane? Are you allowed to bring it with you at all, or no? If you can, do they just put it in the lower bay where it can't be accessed? I'd assume they wouldn't allow it for carry-on, since that makes a terrorist's job all too easy.

I can only imagine how many government censors I've alarmed by my word usage. :eek:

JUST TO BE CLEAR, I'M NOT A TERRORIST.

Hopefully that will be a safe precaution.

unloaded, in checked luggage. I know plenty of people who fly their rifles on hunting trips.

Does having a gun in your luggage mean you are likely to have a snapped glove and a bad afternoon? :D

Actually I was researching Oregon state laws, since I'll be moving up there, and I learned that if you are a concealed carry permit holder and you have a firearm in the car or on you, you're not required by law to inform the police officer that you have a gun. It's a courtesy, really. In Ohio, however, when a cop pulls you over, if you have a gun and you don't tell him right away, it's against the law.

Also, according to wikipedia (and since this is important I would definitely double check this with your state's legislation) you can open carry, meaning your gun can be out and on you in plain sight, without any permit or license. Lucky you!

Still, I'd look online for your state's constitution and read up on it regarding firearms and weapons policies with regard to ownership and carry. Yes it's arduous and irritating sifting through all that text, but the knowledge is worth it.

Keep in mind I'm giving advise based on the strict rules of infamous New York, so I wasn't aware it is considered "courtesy" in some states to tell an officer you're packing heat. In mine it is a health risk to not tell the officer. You are liable to get bad lead poisoning.

So, what of WV? If I travel with it, unloaded, in a case, and am pulled over will I still have it confiscated or get in legal trouble? Anything else I should know.

Yeah I hear ya.

Also, goodbomb:

http://www.gunlaws.com/links/linkswv.htm

Click some of the links on that page and see if you can't find out what you need.

You're mistaking KEEPING and OWNING a handgun with CONCEALED CARRY OF A LOADED HANDGUN which is completely different. Unless you live in a turdhole like New York City or Washington DC, you can OWN a handgun if you are over the age of 21 (without adult supervision, whereas a younger person must have adult supervision of some sort, depending on the state). You need no PERMIT nor LICENSE nor permission to OWN a handgun. You pass some sort of background check and fill out a form 4473 (plus any local or state form), but that's it.

Also in West Virginia, you don't ask the local cops. Only the SHERIFF of your county can issue a concealed carry permit.

Go to http://www.wvcdl.org/.

Don't listen to people giving you advice based on THEIR own states of residence. It does NOT help you one bit.

Oh yeah, that's in no way suspicious, and won't raise any concerns. :D

David.

Hey, better to be obvious and clear myself than let people sleuth through my computer files or something. :cool:

I have always heard that going anywhere but your own home (including your car) with a weapon unloaded in your possession is illegal without some sort of permit. Is this correct?

I very much doubt that. I'm not from your state, or even country, but any gun law has to differentiate between transporting and carrying a gun. Otherwise you could never take it to the range. Our laws are (generally) stricter than yours and carry is for all intents and purposes illegal, but transport is another matter entirely.

Okay. What LIBERALS have you been listening to ? You live in WEST VIRGINIA!!!!!! That's considered a gun FRIENDLY state and massively more friendly than California, Hawaii, Maryland, New Jersey, Illinois or New York. In fact I have NEVER heard the name WEST VIRGINIA mentioned when talking about the states with the worst gun control!

Hell, I looked up WV Laws on the web. and NO it is NOT correct. Hell, that isn't the case in MY own state of California, so now way in hell it's the case in West Virginia.

Read up on your state laws. It's easy.

I love how New York is last on the list. XD

Depends if you're going from worse to worst! ;)

Just Google WV guns laws. and follow those because they vary greatly from state to state

That's what I mean. :)

In Idaho Open Carry is legal with some restrictions. Schools, courthouses, Federal buildings etc. You are not required to tell an officer that you are carrying or that you have a gun in your vehicle. If I stop you for a traffic violation and run your driver license I will also be notifed that you have a Concealed Carry License.

You can have a firearm concealed in your vehicle without a permit. But if for some reason I end up searching your vehicle and find that firearm and that firearm is loaded and you don't have a CCL then I'll be charging you for a weapons violation. If you have a CCL then you'll have no worries.

I know it's a weird law. The NRA (I'm a member) tried to get it changed a few years ago, but we (the cops- many who are members of the NRA) lobbied against it. It's a great tool to use against gangbangers. I did my part by contacting the NRA and explained to the organization why we needed the law. The NRA withdrew it's support after realizing that Idaho law enforcement needed the law.

Last night I was on a traffic stop and there was a pump action shotgun laying in the back of the vehicle. We didn't freak out and get all crazy. We just told the driver to be careful and not make any unexpected movements towards it. He laughed and responded that he might be a bad driver but he isn't stupid. Gave him a warning and sent him on his way.

Idaho is a "Shall Issue State" but the sheriffs have the authority to put requirements in place before issuing a permit. In my county you have to attend a concealed carry class. However if you can show that you have extensive experience with handguns the sheriff will make an exception. For example you have attended Thunder Ranch, Front Sight etc. You were or are a cop. You had a permit in another state (Idaho recognizes permits issued by all other states as well as Puerto Rico and Guam), you were in the military and carried a handgun routinely as part of your duty etc.

In Idaho if you have a permit, are carrying and go into a bar and drink you will lose your permit and you will go to jail. I've taken guys to jail for that very offense.

Also if you are charged with "brandishing" your concealed firearm you will go to jail and lose your permit. Say you get into an argument with a neighbor and decide to pull out your Glock 26 to make a point or just pull back your jacket and say "See that bitch?" That is brandishing and it's stupid.

If you are charged with domestic battery you will go to jail and lose your permit. Well you get the picture.

I have a CCL not because I need one to carry concealed. As a cop I can carry concealed across the United States legally. That's a Federal law. But with a CCL in Idaho a gundealer dosen't have to call Washington D.C. to make sure I can purchase a firearm. It saves everybody some hassle. Not all states are like that however.

Airplane travel is a whole different matter. That's Federal and you better do your research. The Feds will screw you hard when it comes to weapon offenses.

One guy had to sell his Ruger KP90 to my dad's shop because he couldn't keep it over domestic disputes (I think his wife called 911 on him during an argument or something).

What about "brandishing" against some you think may be an attacker (like if you feel threatened by some stranger harassing you in some desolate carpark or something)

Well since I'm not going to waste my time checking on any other state's penal code, the last time I checked, CALIFORNIA's penal code explicitly states that an exception to being punished for 'brandishment' is a reasonable expectation of a threat to your life or the lives of others. So Brandishing is a no no unless you are defending your life or the lives of others. If the guy is just being weird or mouthing off to you, a prosecutor can nail you. If the guy is running at you with a knife, and you brandish a weapon, and he runs off, the penal code says that this is an exception and a "defense against prosecution"....note how they don't say that you can't BE prosecuted. Just that this is a legally accepted defense against prosecution.

AdAstra there is a difference between deploying your firearm because you're in a situation in which you believe your life might be in danger like somebody threatning you with a weapon etc and flashing your handgun at some people that you don't like and are trying to intimidate them.

Or having had too much alcohol and decide that it would be a great idea to pull out your handgun to "impress" everyone.


And yes there is a very good possibility that you might think somebody is a threat to you, you unholster your handgun and then the threat/suspect calls 911 and wants to file a criminal complaint against you for Aggravated Assault.

Does this mean that you are going to be found guilty and automatically lose your permit? No. An investigation would be conducted and the Prosecuting Attorney would make the decision to go to court or not to go to court.

That's how it works. It might not strike you as fair or very satisfying but that's the law. At least that's how we would and do work it in Idaho. Can't speak for Maryland which I know hates gunowners. Sorry.

I'm sure there is somebody who has a horror story about how the cops were assholes and confiscated the CCW holders sidearm and then the handgun vanished and couldn't be accounted for. If you go to The Hgih Road you'll think that there are hundreds of thousands of law abiding gun owners who have their legally owned handguns illegally confiscated and stolen by the cops across the U.S.A.

Well the few times I confiscated a legally owned firearm I returned it once the case was closed and the owner could own it. Obviously there are exceptions.

I have always found that when I feel lacking in my states gun laws I go to the experts. Which means anyone but a patrol officer. I have found that police officers are generally not that informative about the law, believe it or not.

If you're interested in having your gun in your car often, call around to local gun shops or look for local gun shows and schedule a CCW class. They usually have a small fee, and attending these classes is always pretty informative about your state gun laws. And don't get shy in the class. Ask the stupid questions, ask the smart questions, and open a dialogue with your instructor about legal matters where your handgun is concerned.

GET THE CCW. Then learn where you can carry and cannot.

It also helps to be a social person while at the local range. Chat with the people who buy and sell guns, and shoot as often as you can. If you don't have a lot of experience with handguns, get a lot of experience.

I've found there are always some great classes being given for live fire instruction for home protection, self defense with your handgun, firing from your car, etc. But you have to seek those out. It's worth it.

I've had a CCW in Florida, and in Pennsylvania. They are worth the time and investment.